Topic: Acoustic Guitars (Read 828 times)

gaz7224 · « **on:** June 26, 2011, 06:31:59 PM »

Hi,

I can't play a guitar, but I figure if I'm going to record people, I'm gonna need to start collecting instruments.

Are electric acoustic guitars any good? They seem like a easy option because of the line out, rather than needing to mic it. How do they compare, sound-wise, compared to a mic'd acoustic guitar?

Years ago, I knew a guy in a band, and he had one. I thought it sounded really warm and clear. His was top of the range, and I only want to spend £300-£400, so I'm not sure how good a cheaper one will sound.

I've come across a 'Takamine EG5403S'. I've look it up on youtube, but youtube audio isn't very accurate/reliable.

Thanks,
Gaz

stainless · « **Reply #1 on:** June 27, 2011, 11:36:46 AM »

IMHO it is always preferable to mic an acoustic - if you want to use the internal electronics as a "DI" signal then that's always an option, but the piezzo's (which is the most common transducer used) captures mainly the vibration of the body (and often at the bridge where most are mounted).

The a.ri movement at the sound hole is where a lot of the rich resonant harmonics that you might otherwise be missing

but for a scratch track... an acoustic with a pick-up makes life a lot easier

and again, IMHO

RawDepth · « **Reply #2 on:** June 28, 2011, 06:22:30 AM »

Quote from: gaz7224 on June 26, 2011, 06:31:59 PM

...I can't play a guitar, but I figure if I'm going to record people, I'm gonna need to start collecting instruments...

I don't know much about those guitars either, (I'm a drummer,) but I believe that one of the reasons studios collect instruments is to have more top quality sound available and ready to use. Too many musicians come in with instruments that may not be in the best condition or quality. If the studio has a collection of "better quality" and "better sounding" instruments to offer up, it will likely improve the session.

Sometimes it is a matter of genre as well. For example, if a metal band wanted to perform one song that resembles that classic Mississippi Bayou sound, you may want to switch the drum kit and guitars to something that sounds more fitting. The more diversified your collection, the more choices you can fulfill.

If you simply build a collection of cheap junky instruments, you may not be any further ahead than what the bands already have.

Just sayin.

gaz7224 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 12, 2011, 02:25:55 PM »

Thanks for your replies.

It would be helpful for a scratch track, but I'm wondering about value for money. How much does having pickups/preamps in an acoustic guitar add to the price? Is a £500 acoustic guitar likely to sound better, when mic'd, compared to a £500 mic'd electric acoustic? Do you pay a premium?

Gaz

stainless · « **Reply #4 on:** July 12, 2011, 03:08:00 PM »

logic would dictate that the addition of the electronics, plus the time to install should be a cost adder, so IF the acoustic guitar is the same price as the acoustic -electric... well???

there's also the question of how much impact/affect doe the cutting into the acoustic body to instal the controls change the overall tone? Slight perhaps, but I think there's a reason that the design of acoustic guitars (and acoustic instruments in general) remains as unchanged as it has over the decades (and even centuries)

a mic'd acoustic will capture the ambiance of the room, the pick-ups not so much (true some are microphonic to some extent... but that's more a design flaw than feature... IMHO)

gaz7224 · « **Reply #5 on:** July 13, 2011, 03:58:45 PM »

Quote

logic would dictate that the addition of the electronics, plus the time to install should be a cost adder, so IF the acoustic guitar is the same price as the acoustic -electric... well???

I guessed that, but I thought I'd ask just in case.

It's a bit weird browsing for guitars on line, but I have and have found one I like. Here: http://www.dv247.com/guitars/godin-5th-avenue-archtop-acoustic-guitar-cognac-burst--68333

Youtube review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1AENDjlD2c&feature=player_embedded#at=127

I really like its sound, but I'm not sure it would be very versatile because it's more country/blues and jazz-sounding. I listen to a lot of country, but I'd doubt it'd get used much cuz the city where I live is quite indie and rock, if that makes sense, and I can't be picky and dictate what music genre I'll record cuz that's stupid, even though I'd love to record country. I'm not sure the guitar would sound right on a indie-rock track?

Any recommendations for a versatile acoustic guitar? Is there a style of acoustic guitar that is suitable for a wide range of music genres?

I have a lot to learn about instruments huh.

Gaz

stainless · « **Reply #6 on:** July 13, 2011, 04:08:03 PM »

a pre Fender Guild, a US made Epiphone- some of the Carvins are pretty decent

everything else that comes to mind will be at or above $1000 used

a Dreadnaught or Jumbo body would probably serve you best- mahogany sides/back and spruce top is pretty standard, but they tend to have a bit more bottom, whereas if you find one with maple sides/back and a spruce top they tend to be 'brighter'

gaz7224 · « **Reply #7 on:** July 28, 2011, 02:19:25 PM »

I've had a look, and I've come across a 'Epiphone Masterbilt AJ-500R'. The reviews are very good, and I'll go listen before I buy, but I'm wondering if you are familiar with it? Its MSRP is $999, but I've found it for £430, which is OK. Is a $999 epiphone classed as a 'decent' studio guitar? Or do I need to spend a bit more?

Thanks

stainless · « **Reply #8 on:** July 28, 2011, 02:41:21 PM »

I've no first hand experience with Epiphones in recent years. Back in 70's they were excellent guitars which unfortunately stayed in the shadows of Gibson. about 10 years ago I purchased a Epi 335 dot neck.... it was sadly disappointing

here's some discussions I found that you might want to check outhttp://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/51228-review-gibson-advanced-jumbo-vs-epiphone-masterbilt-aj-500re/

how a guitar sounds to one's ears is very subjective and is greatly influenced by the person playing. I have a number of guitars (more than I really need) and some may only get used a couple times a year for recording, but they have a distinct (to my ear) sound, so when i need 'that' sound... I have 'that" guitar

kip4 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 28, 2011, 02:47:11 PM »

good call
i too do this i have from high end to pawn shop prizes and junk too and they all have there day even the sitar copy lol

gaz7224 · « **Reply #10 on:** August 26, 2011, 02:52:52 PM »

Anyone heard a Gibson J-185? It's a bit more expensive, but since I've stopped throwing money at women and alcohol, I have a better budget lol.

stainless · « **Reply #11 on:** August 26, 2011, 03:04:10 PM »

nice guitar... and that's quite a jump from your original budget!

if that budget fits also consider Taylors

kip4 · « **Reply #12 on:** August 26, 2011, 05:18:38 PM »

Taylors record beautifully i must say . I dont own one or work for them but i have had the chance to record 3 differant artists with taylors and they take eq well and record beautifully even DI'd

RazorLand Studio · « **Reply #13 on:** September 16, 2011, 04:07:44 PM »

I have an Epi EJ-200, it is their version of a Gibson J-200 Jumbo bodied guitar with a Shadow pick up system in it and i also have a 35 year old Washburn D-15 MB with a undersaddle piezo in it. The Epi has a pretty fair plugged in sound, the Washburn sounds pretty electric plugged in, but as old as it is that is to be expected.
I have gotten my best results recording either guitar using a standard mic technique.......large diaphragm condenser pointing at the 12th about 8 inches of so away, just off axis, a small diaphragm condenser pointed at the bridge about 8 inches also just off axis and also laying a track of the onboard pick up....then blending the 3 to get best results. Have found that I use very little of the onboard track as opposed to the mic tracks. The mics just seem to have much more air and wood sound and are much more pleasing to the ear.

stainless · « **Reply #14 on:** September 16, 2011, 04:11:30 PM »

RazorL

have you always used th eLDC at the 12th and SDC at the bridge? I do just the opposite (I'll have to try switching)

what's you signal chain?

RazorLand Studio · « **Reply #15 on:** September 16, 2011, 06:56:14 PM »

I have tried both and it seems to be a touch warmer using the LDC on the neck, at least in my set up. I run the mics straight into my console, out of the console through a subgroup into the inputs on my interface......i use no plug ins etc to lay tracks, and run the channel eq on the console flat, then add any sweetening after the tracks are recorded. Seems to work pretty good. Actually getting my best results recording acoustic guitars.

stainless · « **Reply #16 on:** September 16, 2011, 07:59:39 PM »

what mics do you use?

I typically use a AT 4040 and either a AT-2021 or a MXL 603c Mogami (I have a Rode NT3, but haven't tried it)- These are run into a Prism pre and then into the interface.

I also will sometimes use the pick-up (through a Bellari tube DI.... I highly recommend these... hard to find but worth it IMHO) and as you mentioned it's often the lowest level of the 3

RazorLand Studio · « **Reply #17 on:** September 16, 2011, 08:07:27 PM »

I have a Blue Bluebird that I use a lot it is an awesome vocal mic as well, and a Sterling Audio SDC, I cant recall the model right now and dont wanna get up and look LOL And also have an AKG Perception 400 that works very well.....have also tried placing a third mic direct on the soundhole about 4 inches off....generally use a SM 57 for that. Give that Rode a shot, I think youll be pleased with the results.

Went and checked out your music page..........your stuff sounds great..........very Dead sound to it....gotta love Jerry and the guys

stainless · « **Reply #18 on:** September 16, 2011, 08:28:33 PM »

wow, another Dead reference... I'll take it! Thanks

I've looked at the Sterling mics, they look pretty good, any sibilance issues?

buying mics is always a crap shoot... and I've crapped out a few times. Been real happy with the Jolie mods... although I have a MXL 990 with the U47 mod. that it is a nice mic and improved it greatly... I just don't use that much and may sell/trade it

The Octava (Russian) M-319's with his mod ... excellent...he modded a pair for me.. see a lot of use on vocals, especially female

I probably have too many mics...

RazorLand Studio · « **Reply #19 on:** September 16, 2011, 08:36:40 PM »

Havent had any problems with sibilance on the Sterling, but have never used it for vocals so I really wouldnt know.

All my mics are box stock..have a pair of the MXL 990's one for a control room talkback the other for the tracking room talkback.they work awesome for that.

I have a pretty full locker myself, lots of dynamics I used to use for live stuff......8, SM57's , 5, SM58's a couple older EV nDyms, a AKG D-112 and a really sweet pair of AT Pro 37r's, those are the BEST overheads I have ever used and believe it or not they sound really sweet on pianos as well. Also have a pair of old Shure 55SW's that need to be reconditioned, they are retired to the shelf above my console for decorations now days.

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Author Topic: Acoustic Guitars (Read 828 times)